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Lithium-ion Electric Doblò Travels 300km in One Day With Three Fast Recharges
9 October 2007
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| Micro-Vett electric Fiat Doblò. |
A Micro-Vett Fiat Doblò, a regular size 5-seat station wagon, powered by a custom 18kWh Altairnano lithium-ion NanoSafe battery pack, traveled 300 kilometers (186 miles) in one day in an urban delivery circuit. The custom battery pack was fully recharged in less than ten minutes a total of three times using AeroViroments’ high voltage, 125kW rated, rapid charging system.
The demonstration came halfway through an ongoing 60-day demonstration of the 5-seat electric vehicle by AeroVironment, Inc.; Altair Nanotechnologies Inc.; Micro-Vett, SPA; and Go Green Holding AS to government officials and potential commercial customers in Oslo, Norway.
The standard Micro-Vett Fiat Doblò uses a 43 kWh lead-acid battery pack, providing a range of 150 km (93 miles) in the urban duty cycle on a single charge; recharging takes 5-8 hours. The vehicle uses a 30 kW (60 kW peak) motor from Ansaldo Electric Drives.
Micro-Vett has been manufacturing electric vehicles since 1987 and so we constantly follow energy accumulation systems evolution, from batteries to fuel cells. Until now we’ve seen some developments, but Altairnano’s fast charge batteries have the potential to revolutionize electric vehicles and also the automotive industry. It was very exciting to see Doblò’s charge level indicator going up visibly in Oslo. With Altairnano’s fast charge batteries, we can overcome the primary electric vehicle limitation because we can achieve refuelling times comparable to those of gasoline-powered vehicles.
—Massimiliano Di Gioia, Micro-Vett Vice President
The lithium-ion Doblò will be driven an estimated total of 7,500 kilometers (4,660 miles) during the 60-day demonstration period, which translates to an annual equivalent use of 45,000 kilometers (28,000 miles).
Go Green expects to ship up to 20 Micro-Vett vehicles with Altairnano’s 18kWh NanoSafe battery packs to customers in the next several months, and an additional 250 vehicles are planned for shipment in 2008. Altairnano offers a range of battery packs for all-electric vehicles requiring from 10 to 35 kWh of energy storage.
October 9, 2007 in Electric (Battery) | Permalink | Comments (45) | TrackBack (0)
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Comments
how many bucks for the 18kwh nanosafe battery ?
Posted by: itsme | Oct 9, 2007 7:12:54 AM
Dang, I was going to buy alti when it was at $3/share a few weeks ago---it spiked more than 20% today.
Posted by: Mike | Oct 9, 2007 7:23:00 AM
the correct question is: what will the battery cost in 3 years when it's selling in the tens of millions?
this battery is the best battery in the world. do some due diligence. they've cycled this battery over 25,000 times and still retain 85% capacity.
AES the big electric utility is an owner of this company and they are developing a 1MW battery for grid storage and load leveling. this is by far the best battery in the world. it WILL NOT HEAT UP. thermal runaway is a non-issue with this battery.
Posted by: rick | Oct 9, 2007 7:30:05 AM
As far as I remember Phoenix had an exclusive deal with Altair to use their batteries. However, it was made conditional on Phoenix actually ordering a minimum quantity of batteries from Altair. It seems the exclusive deal with Phoenix is off and Altair is selling their batteries to others. I wish Altair good luck and hope they will soon find a real customer among the established vehicle producers. The website of http://www.micro-vett.it/eng/indexing.html looks like a joke and I wander how the rest of the firm is operated.
Does anyone have a price on this product?
Posted by: Henrik | Oct 9, 2007 7:45:49 AM
Nice to see someone buying some Nanosafe batteries. I still Phoenix could have a real winner if they could get some investment capital going.
Posted by: domenick | Oct 9, 2007 8:05:25 AM
rick;
I too think that Altairnano batteries have a lot to offer for PHEVs and specially BEVs. Safety + Very fast (10 minutes) multiple (25000+) charge-discharge is exactly what is required.
Let's hope that the current price of about $1000+/KWh will drop to about $300/KWh when mass produced in very large factories in countries with lower labour cost by (2010-2012?)
Will competition do better? and cheaper? Time will tell.
Posted by: Harvey D | Oct 9, 2007 8:09:45 AM
Altair's exclusivity agreement with Phoenix is in the US only and is only for EV road vehicles. This leaves Altair a lot of flexibility to sell outside the US and in the US for PHEV's and other uses. BTW, ALTI's up over 50% as I write this and I did buy at around $3. Woo hoo!
Posted by: Paul | Oct 9, 2007 8:41:48 AM
Yeah I was going to buy $1,000 worth. I purchased 100 shares @ $3.50 and was waiting for the stock to go to $3 and buy the rest.
Anyone know anything about if ALTI has any options trading?
Posted by: Mike Z | Oct 9, 2007 8:44:45 AM
I saw a link, I think here, that Altair is licensing batteries to an electric car startup in the UK, also: www.lightningcarcompany.com Could be Phoenix's exclusive rights are limited, e.g., to the US auto market.
Posted by: Jim G. | Oct 9, 2007 9:15:26 AM
re: options
no, no options... only stock
BC
Posted by: bruno cipolla | Oct 9, 2007 9:20:34 AM
~62 mile range is not much, going to need bigger batteries and greater range for full production EVs. But rapid recharge is a BIG improvement.
Posted by: | Oct 9, 2007 11:39:18 AM
As an owner of Altairnano stock this is a nice morning. But the battery situation is going to take roughly another year before the winners and losers emerge.
Invest money only if you are willing to lose 100%.
Small tech companies never know when their patents and product will be made worthless by a single improvement or event elsewhere.
No big company is committed to Altairnano batteries. And several, such as GM, are buying elsewhere. It is anyone's guess what that means - which is why stocks rise and fall.
Anyway, I am glad to see Altair dealing with Fiat. Phoenix may do OK but their recent announcements have worried me. They seem to have lost focus.
Posted by: K | Oct 9, 2007 11:59:13 AM
Good investment advice K!
Posted by: marcus | Oct 9, 2007 12:07:41 PM
This solution makes sense for operators of delivery fleets, who can afford 25kWe gensets or utility drops on site and, can train staff in the safe handling of the cables and connectors associated with such high power levels. 100km is a substantial acion radius for e.g. an urban delivery vehicle. Boosting it to 300km via a couple of rapid recharges during the day is very attractive.
I don't think recharging that often is attractive for members of the general public, though. For a commuter car, trickle-charging at night would be preferable - iff you have a garage or access to a secured outdoor outlet. Longer distances will remain impossible until there is a network of fast recharge stations - the usual chicken-and-egg bootstrapping problem.
Posted by: Rafael Seidl | Oct 9, 2007 12:56:48 PM
K ,
Altair are not dealing with Fiat , Micro Vett are a compleatly separate
company , Fiat want nothing to do with BEV´s and are still investing heavily
down the fool cell route !
Posted by: andrichrose | Oct 9, 2007 1:34:27 PM
Rafael:
Colocating fast charge stations with most existing fuel stations should not be a major problem. Electricity is already available most everywhere. Fuel pumps could progressively be phased out in favor of charge stations.
Handling a flexible insulated power cable should not be that different from a fuel hose and nozzle. Most North Americans, could learn how to do that. For reluctant drivers, service attendants could do it for a very small fee.
Eventually, an automatic, car roof top connector, could take care of this task for reluctant and disabled drivers. The 300 and 400 pounders would not even have to get out of their vehicles.
Posted by: Harvey D | Oct 9, 2007 2:13:35 PM
Micro Vett is supposed to be a pretty big player in the European BEV world. I don't know anything about Go Green but they say they tested allot of other batteries (including A123's) and favor Altair's nanosafes.
http://www.go-green.no
Posted by: yo | Oct 9, 2007 2:59:25 PM
@Harvey D -
25kW is a big utiliy drop, involving both high voltage and high current. It think there might be some safety concerns having that in close proximity to flammable fuels like gasoline.
Besides, recharge stations would be franchisees of the utilities. Gas stations are franchisees of the oil industry. IFF PHEVs/BEVs ever achieve signiicant market share, these two industries will be competitors.
Posted by: Rafael Seidl | Oct 9, 2007 3:03:17 PM
I also own a handful of shares in Altair, but K is right in that you have to be willing to make a bet. For instance, if GM actually has the will to follow through on the Volt project and it's a success, A123, which likely has that contract, might be eating Altair's lunch.
This expansion for Altair is good news, but it's too bad Fiat itself didn't take the leap, or at least invest as a joint venture. It would be so nice to have at least one large automaker seriously involved in EV's. Once one of these startups gets regular customers and predictable revenue, we'll see the ramp up and the price drop.
As to the recharging stations: being a potential early-adopter of these things, I realize part of Altair's advantage is it's fast-recharge, I'm be perfectly content to be limited to overnight 120 VAC charging; I doubt I'm alone in that.
Posted by: Jim G. | Oct 9, 2007 3:11:15 PM
andrichrose: You are fight. I read that the vehicle was a Fiat and erred.
Apparently a Fiat shell is the EV testbed.
In any case it looks like good news. I want EVs but not just any EVs.
It is hard or impossible to get good data on battery cost curves. For now everything depends on that.
Posted by: K | Oct 9, 2007 3:14:37 PM
@Harvey D,
Handling 25kwe power lines is not something that you want your average gas jockey to be handling. Its like feuling your ICE with a little nitro boost...
That is dangerous stuff.
Posted by: Stan Peterson | Oct 9, 2007 3:15:59 PM
@Harvey D,
Handling 25kwe power lines is not something that you want your average gas jockey to be handling. Its like feuling your ICE with a little nitro boost...
That is dangerous stuff.
Posted by: Stan Peterson | Oct 9, 2007 3:16:40 PM
Raphael: If the oil industry is smart, it will see the writing on the wall and branch out even further into electrical generation and go after the quick charge market. There will be a quick charge market for people that can't trickle charge at night or who need the extra juice during the day.
Posted by: Neil | Oct 9, 2007 3:56:41 PM
This is great news for a number of reasons:
1/ light commercial traffic is growing rapidly and makes up a substantial proportion of vehicle traffic, especially outside peak periods.
2/I used to drive a light truck for a warehouse distribution company in Sydney (4m population). We would never drive 300km in a day. Most operators wouldn't need to charge three times in a day and some days you would get away without stopping for a recharge.
3/ The stop-start nature of delivery driving is ideally suited for EV torque and regenerative braking.
In a short time EV's are going to be a very attractive proposition for distribution and delivery, especially with rising diesel and petrol costs.
Posted by: critts | Oct 9, 2007 4:30:06 PM
Stan Peterson - "Handling 25kwe power lines is not something that you want your average gas jockey to be handling. Its like feuling your ICE with a little nitro boost..."
Perhaps you can use something like this:
http://www.offshore-technology.com/contractors/cables/diamould/diamould3.html
It is rated to 8kV and 200amps and is safe to use underwater. You really need to think about how dangerous petrol is. We have just gotten used to it.
Posted by: Ender | Oct 9, 2007 5:11:22 PM
Rafael, Harvey D, Stan and others.
I´m confused with the 25 Kw you are speaking about. The article says "AeroViroment´s high voltage 125 Kw rated" and this is the power needed to charge 18 Kwh in about 10 minutes(1/6h).
125 Kw*1/6 h=20.83 Kwh consider the charge-discharge efficiency.
Posted by: Mario | Oct 9, 2007 5:50:30 PM
critts - I totally agree. And that is presumably why SmithEV ( http://www.smithelectricvehicles.com ) is specifically targetting the return-to-base delivery fleets with its current range of roadgoing all-electric vans. Come the day when serious progress in battery development makes the recharge argument irrelevant, every maker on the planet will be targetting every driver. But for now, SmithEV are coining it, and Tanfield Group (their UK owner) has seen its share price soar nineteenfold in little over a year (I know because I own some!). In December their first US-built vehicles will begin production at Fresno, California (1000 in year one, and several times that in year two when a new 250,000sq.ft US factory is finished)
Posted by: John Latusek | Oct 10, 2007 6:08:11 AM
I've been looking into stock in both A123 and Altair nano. As far as I can see A123 isn't publicly traded, has anyone found different?
I'm watching for Altair to settle some, because I want it. Why haven't they found a bigger customer than Phoenix yet? Are they managed well?
Posted by: Elliot | Oct 10, 2007 6:33:12 AM
Oops. Ninefold is what I meant in my last post, not nineteenfold!
Posted by: John Latusek | Oct 10, 2007 7:08:31 AM
One point to make on the charging stations...
Altair is using its own batteries to store a charge which is then transferred to the vehicle (at least that is part of their overall plan). These stations will have battery capacity enough to quick charge 3 or 4 vehicles. Thus, unless numerous vehicles were backed up waiting for a quick charge, a station could use a much lower power requirements to recharge the charging station itself (and thus do away with the need for high-voltage lines running directly to the station as well as the potential problems of peak power draw). This is much the same concept as the power-leveling stations that they are working on with power companies. It is part of the appeal of Altair batteries--they can both charge and discharge (and thus transfer) power at the same extremely rapid rate. Sure, you still need a hefty cord connecting the station to the vehicle, but I'm pretty confident in the possibility of making this at least as safe as petrol fueling.
Posted by: Paul | Oct 10, 2007 7:21:19 AM
Instead of quick recharging why not exchange the battery and then the station recharges the exhausted battery for the next client, and so on ...
Ivan
Posted by: Ivan | Oct 10, 2007 10:30:57 AM
Ivan: the main objection to battery exchange is that the battery packs will be of different quality.
Who wants to have a new car with brand new batteries under warranty and take the luck of the draw 200 miles later when a four-year-old battery pack slides into your car? Who warrants that one?
So exchanges must have an $$ adjustment for battery quality. And accurate assessment of that quality is not easily done.
The quality problem is not fatal but it is a concern. There are other problems too. A standard pack can't be too big or small vehicles can't use it. The pack can't be too small or large vehicles will use several with a weight penalty.
Access to the pack compartment of the vehicle must be standardized. That is a bit more complex than using a simple filler hose or electrical plug.
Posted by: K | Oct 10, 2007 1:33:18 PM
Ivan: the main objection to battery exchange is that the battery packs will be of different quality.
Who wants to have a new car with brand new batteries under warranty and take the luck of the draw 200 miles later when a four-year-old battery pack slides into your car? Who warrants that one?
So exchanges must have an $$ adjustment for battery quality. And accurate assessment of that quality is not easily done.
The quality problem is not fatal but it is a concern. There are other problems too. A standard pack can't be too big or small vehicles can't use it. The pack can't be too small or large vehicles will use several with a weight penalty.
Access to the pack compartment of the vehicle must be standardized. That is a bit more complex than using a simple filler duct or electrical plug.
Station charging does eliminate the on-board charging electronics. That is good, but electronics is not the cost problem. And some is needed anyway to recover braking and coasting energy.
Posted by: K | Oct 10, 2007 1:38:24 PM
I doubt that PHEVs and BEVs will be charged directly with 25Kv or 125 Kv. It will most probably use existing voltage standards such as 660 VAC @ 100 amps = 66 KWh/hour or about 11 KWh/10 minutes.
Appropriate 660 VAC/100 Amps flexible cable and connectors already exist. Of course you would plug your car in with the power source switch (OFF). An interlock would prevent you from doing otherwise.
Once properly connected, pushing a microswitch (ON) button would do the rest. Disconnecting the power source would be automatic when your batteries are full or manually by pushing the microswitch button once again.
Let's not complicate something that is easy to do.
Posted by: Harvey D | Oct 11, 2007 11:08:22 AM
Although it seems likely that petro and electric franchises will be competitors - some forward looking companies like BP would do well to get onboard with quick charge stations from the get go. Establishing a brand name in support of PHEV/BEV vehicles will go a long way to build customer recognition and will help the launch of BEVs with Altair-type batteries.
Building a separate electric charge island in most fuel stations should not prove difficult especially with some incentives and a local fleet contract to help financing. Another possibility is to build out "fast, medium and slow" charge stations and price the time factor accordingly.
Looks like good news for Alti investors.
Posted by: gr | Oct 11, 2007 11:23:31 PM
Hi everybody,
NEWTEON is the european distributor for Micro-Vett EV and others.
I just wanted to inform you that FIAT IS working together with Micro-Vett on EV.
During the world first présentation of the NEW FIAT FIORINO, the 4th of October at Transpotech Milano, FIAT proposed on the same stand the electric version prepared by Micro-Vett for FIAT (and for NEWTEON ;)
www.newteon.com
http://www.motorsport.it/articolo/3045/fiat_fiorino.html
best regards,
Sergio Contaldo
Posted by: Sergio Contaldo | Oct 12, 2007 4:04:56 AM
You can see a video of the vehicle being charged here.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rcbx57Azisw
The same youtube account also has some other footage you may enjoy of the vehicle in motion.
Posted by: domenick | Oct 12, 2007 4:21:41 AM
One important precision: the standard Micro-Vett Doblò uses lithium-ion batteries and not lead-acid batteries as mentionned in the article.
Sandie Giacobi
Posted by: NEWTEON ecofriendly vehicles | Oct 15, 2007 1:27:27 AM
Investment capital can be very difficult to come by. If we want innovation to lead the way, we will have to form the capital more readily.
Posted by: sjc | Oct 15, 2007 10:18:28 AM
Who can tell me how much for this cool all-electric wagon? Thanks
Posted by: Qin | Oct 16, 2007 11:37:15 AM
I'm an Altair shareholder from Norway. I have been accumulating here since February 2007. I see some of you ask about the price of the Altair batteries. Actually this is given in the presentation at Go Greens homepage.
By now, as far as I know, one battery-package has been delivered. The price charged by Altairnano is 2$ pr watt.
Go Green are now working in two areas: Getting potential customers in the fleet market for these rebuilt Fiat's and financing a smaller network of fast recharge stations in the rural Oslo area.
Posted by: olemt | Oct 18, 2007 1:01:44 PM
Hi, I've discovered ALTAIR tecnology recently, i'm from Italy, but FIAT and the national media dont have spent a word about this bettery innovation or collaboration of Micro-Wett with FIAT or ALTAIR, not a word!!!
Fiat Leader MONTEZEMOLO is too occupied to think a FERRARI world championship or a selling of 500!!
Our politics wants stop our gasoline vehicles euro 0 to help the selling of new model, not a word on the Evs!!
Posted by: nickwest@tiscali.it | Nov 7, 2007 2:21:16 PM
alti go ahead make my day....
this company looks like a hot air balloon....
exclusive contract with phoenix???????
looks to me like a fake....if they got the good then they would not have done this....their technology is not belonged to them it is probably belong to the government?????
good luck in getting your hand on one of these gooffyy stuff.....hahahahahaha
Posted by: goofffyyy | Nov 8, 2007 12:18:03 AM
nice blog find salvage auto links here http://autobuysell.wsnw.net
Posted by: mark | Nov 8, 2007 4:06:23 AM
hi i m from amsterdam and i want to say there are more state of the art batteries in america i know Altair nano and A123 but also look at Valence and Enerdel but fore now
i think altair is the best and i hope i will drive an ev powered bij one of these in the near electric future.don t think about waterloosecells it,s a waste of money and energy.
Posted by: rene | Dec 11, 2007 10:25:52 AM
