It is to be hoped this policy isn't retrofitted for that black sticky stuff from Saudi.

Does anyone know if fuel derived from thermal depolymerisation gets the tax credit?

National Biodiesel Board and Soybean Association are shooting themselves in the foot. How do they expect this grassroots movement to catch if it isn't more affordable than gas? That infuriates me to the point of buying a hybrid instead of a diesel.

Don't bother writing the NBB.  Write your representative, your senators, and the editor of the local newspaper.

The law perverted! And the police powers of the state perverted along with it! The law, I say, not only turned from its proper purpose but made to follow an entirely contrary purpose! The law become the weapon of every kind of greed! Instead of checking crime, the law itself guilty of the evils it is supposed to punish! If this is true, it is a serious fact, and moral duty requires me to call the attention of my fellow-citizens to it.

Greedy capitalists? More like greedy mercantilists. Capitalism is the name given to the economic order that spontainiously occures when property rights are respected. Although pervasive throughout man's history and especially the modern world, and very much a part of the modern American political tradition, protectionism is not capitalistic, it is socialistic, it's socialism for the politically influential and connected business classes, in this case for the likes of ADM. So call the supporters of this protectionism greedy for sure, for they are willing to pervert the law and to use it for plundering their neighbors for their own profit, to deny their neighbor's right to freedom of contract, but don't call them capitalists.

The fuel produced by thermal depolymerization (TDP) is currently excluded from the tax credit. (Another example of anything useful getting excluded?) This is a large part of TDP's financial problems as it adds about $40/barrel to the production cost. Thanks to that and the fact that they actually have to pay for the feedstock (inspite of mad cow disease you can still feed offal to farm animals) the cost increased from the estimated $15/barrel to ~$80/barrel.

At least the senate version of the energy bill includes a tax credit for TDP. Let's hope it can slip past the all-powerful farm lobby.

The simple economic fact of the matter is this: At its most basic level, prices reflect supply and demand. When a lobby forces the taxpayers to subsidize a product so that it can be competitive with foreign production, there is an imbalance in the force.

In this case, the soybean lobby is riding on the backs of the taxpayers, and the taxpayer is again gouged at the Diesel pump.

Optimist is right: There should be no subsidies, and the oils should be freely traded on the international commodities board where the demands of the international market place determine the price.

The only fair alternative to no subsidies would be to subsidize all domestic products that face foreign competition.

That should make everyone happy, except for the taxpayer who is paying for the subsidies.

I'd happily pay a DOLLAR more at the pump if it meant that we weren't importing any oil (and contributing to demand for ME oil and thus supporting terrorism).  Heck, even two dollars.  (My car goes 650+ miles on an 18-gallon tank.)

The idiots who bought Excursions and Hummers and Durangos wouldn't like it much, though.  Which is the point, isn't it?

Reply to Mike Briggs:

"Can any of you who are all up in arms over this explain why our tax dollars should be used to subsidize FOREIGN production of fuel?"

This is a bizarre way of reasoning: biodiesel derived from palm oil is ALREADY CHEAPER than ordinary dinodiesel. So it DOESN'T NEED SUBSIDIES.

And that's why the American soy lobby is so worried: because you can produce biodiesel without subsidies, provided you use the best feedstock, which is palm oil.

The soylobby fears for its subsidies. It's pretty obvious, don't you think? The SOY LOBBY is TRYING TO GRAB AMERICANS' TAX MONEY TO FILL ITS OWN POCKETS, while Americans are denied palmdiesel which they should be allowed to buy without being ripped off.

Yep, leave it to us liberals to ask the RIGHT questions, and not get lost in the wrong ones.

Still stuck on the subsidies?

1. US taxpayers subsidize the petroleum industry with $100's of billions each year so that we can enjoy cheap gas at the pump. If not (ie, the oil companies paid their own way), the pump price would be as much as $15 per gallon.

2. Even if American consumers knew what biodiesel is (and they don't - if they've even heard of it they think it means hippies collecting WVO all day to pour directly into in an old painted-up school bus), they wouldn't buy it if it were a nickel more at the pump.

3. Since the pump will never reflect the true cost of gasoline (especially with government run by oil men), then why should biodiesel? Do you like petroleum (and all its baggage) so much that you want biodiesel to fail? B100 is already available at at least 10% of all gas stations in Germany, even selling for slightly less than petrodiesel. But their petrodiesel is $5/gal, and taxed much more heavily than the bio (gee, a (reverse) subsidy!). If you want any alternative fuel to succeed in the US, you have to get realistic about just how much the deck has been stacked in favor of the traditional energy industries they're competing against. Crying "fair market" is retarded.

Why palm oil?

1. Yes, palm oil has long been the cheapest on the market. Just like Walmart has been the cheapest place to buy your socks. Informed people try to avoid them both.

2. In some countries (Indonesia for one) rain forests are being destroyed at 1% a year to make way for oil palm plantations. And at a benefit for very few. The careless rush to industrialization is causing much more harm than good for the indegenous peoples. Not to mention the obvious loss of plant & animal species and climate change issues.

3. Oil palms can't make that much of a dent in any large-scale demand anyway. Unless you think the rainforests are simply a waste of space and couldn't be burned away fast enough to make way for palm plantations.

4. Biodiesel from palm oil has a relatively high cloud point (> 57F), severely limiting is usability.

The right questions?

1. How about, will high-yield and alternative feedstocks that can be grown domestically with low impact (algaes, mustards, switch grasses, jatropha, TDP) enjoy the same support or more, as the "Big 4"?

2. Or, what kind of gov support can biodiesel be given that would otherwise go to its competitor petroleum?

3. Are you doing everything you can personally to promote the use of biodiesel and reduction for demand of petroleum (through creating greater public awareness, pushing for increased availability of more & better diesel vehicles, demanding better support from our gov, etc)?

Lamar, I'm in favor of being given all the money in the world so that I can distribute it as I see fit. Does that have anything to do with reality?

Again, back to something that has nothing to do with anything. Seems to me you'd make a lot better use of oxygen by figuring out how to make this an important issue for the folks on your side of the fence, rather than worrying about the side that's at least trying to be part of the solution rather than the problem.

Good. We need to block this and the US needs to start promoting self sufficiency and less free trade. Like we owe something to these other countries. If you agree to cheaper palm oil prices than u are no better than the right wingers that promote cheap labor practices and send our jobs overseas