In the European press there is some more detail about Hyundai's hybrid plans. It will start to sell an Elantra hybrid in South Korea in 2009. A LI-based Sonata will be introduced in various markets in 2010. The Sonata prototype will be shown at the LA Autoshow in Nov.

Hyundai is saying "it will take all the Li-Ion batteries that LG Chem can make..." in 2013. GM is now facing the same problem that shafted Ford. Ford suffered in its relationship with Sanyo as a battery supplier.

GM may fined the Volt is without batteries in sufficient numbers, in 2013. Just like Japanese battery firm Sanyo, sent a significant quantity of its CONTRACTED production meant for the Ford Escape hybrid elsewhere, to Japanese auto firms. Meanwhile making excuses that there were "production problems". Something similar can be anticipated with the Korean firms.

If the domestic automakers are to compete, the US automakers need preferably domestic suppliers, but at least domestic factories building domestic supplies of Li-Ion batteries, for them.

The Democrat Jacka$$ses have established the Microsoft anti-monopoly precedents, while rewarding the "Big Law" legal gangsters like David Boies firm, for campaign contri/bribes. It would not be now illegal for GM, Ford or Chrysler to bring battery manufacture in house, without being subject to a possible anti-monopoly persecution.

If I were a domestic automaker I would at minimum, require dual source for all my batteries. And/or require an automated battery making facility be erected by the supplier near my assembly plant(s).

stas:

For once I agree with you. The Big-3 will have to find regular local suppliers for quality battery packs in sufficient quantity for their HEV, PHEV and BEV.

Toyota has in house supplies. Nissan has almost the same arragement with NEC, Hyhundai and LG will develop close relationship, etc.

I would even go one step further. USA should promote local battery production with $50 B to $100 B loan guarantees (and the same for the Big-3) to get this new industry going at an accellerated pace.

What is $100 B to $200 B to save a major industry and to initiate a new one. It would be a much better investment than to support oil wars.

We need leaders with vision. Otherwise, leading industries will move out.

Lead-acid batteries are now being made that can be used in plug-in-hybrids, including VOLT. Such use was demonstrated by the TZERO and its prototypes ten years ago. EFFPOWER has prototyped the highest power versions of such batteries, and even the GOLD-TOP SIXPAK RV batteries that you can buy in an auto parts store are highly suited.

If EFFPOWER could use the FIREFLY foam they would have an additional advantage. Atraverda is threatening to actualy get its high power bipolar battery also made. There was a lot of goverment funded bipolar lead battery research done in the EU a few years back because highvoltage bpolar batteries have much less weight in pure lead for conducting current.

In theory, all conductor lead can be eliminated. FireFly is a partial demonstration of this fact. The acid electrolyte actually has seven times the volume of the lead used for energy storage. The plates that you can see are mostly hidden conductors made of lead usually. Some production cells had copper in the negative plates.

ZEBRA batteries are the most reliable highest energy density batteries on the market. Perhaps the L-ION batteries will get good enough and cheap enough so that the manufacturer of Zebra Batteries will run an efficient and low cost manufacturing operation when it gets it volume higher due to TH!NK.

Small lowstressed fiber flywheels with iron-less alternators can meet any brief high power demands with relatively low weight and lower complexity than ultra-caps. The are only intended to be used with batteries to allow the use of lower power but higher energy density batteries, but they could be used alone in just the regenerative hybrid mode with many cost savings. There is quite enough of the materials needed to build such flywheels. Steel ones were used on NYC subway cars.

Parry People Movers demonstrated the effective energy efficient use of low technology flywheels for commuter traffic. Two bespoke vehicles will take over service this year from standard heavy rail vehicles. The service was demonstated with a prototype vehicle for several weeks. Many years ago some people claimed that they could build flywheels that could store energy for months. This is not necessary for plug-in-hybrid cars. The engine eliminates the need for high capacity long term energy storage. Few chemical reactions have higher energy per reactant volume than hydrocarbons. There is more hydrogen in isooctane than there is in the same volume of liquid hydrogen. Methanol has less carbon per hydrogen than almost any other room temperature liquid fuel. It would be cheaper to capture carbondioxide and recycle it into liquid fuels than to use hydrogen fuel. ..HG..