Siemens Building 100-Unit Electric Car Fleet for Employee Use and Testing
12 October 2010
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| Siemens EV. Click to enlarge. |
Siemens is building up a fleet of 100 electric vehicles for use and testing by employees. Called 4-S (4-Sustainelectromobility), the pilot project is focusing on the interplay between the electric cars and their infrastructure. Besides testing of the components, the project’s objective is to research and develop new business models.
Siemens expects there will be more than one million electric cars on the road worldwide in the foreseeable future, when they will form part of a smart grid.
The pilot project is divided into three stages and will initially be limited to the company locations in Munich and Erlangen. During the first stage, which will kick off in November, 20 vehicles will be given for testing to employees in southern Erlangen and in Munich’s Neuperlach district. The focus will initially be on testing the infrastructure.
During the second stage, which is scheduled to commence in spring 2011, 15 electric vehicles will be equipped with a drive system developed by the Siemens Corporate Technology (CT) group and subsequently tested by employees. At the same time, Siemens will set up an in-house electric car-sharing system in Berlin. In the final stage, which is to start in fall 2011, the vehicles will be fitted with drive systems from the Industry Sector.
The entire project is being managed by CT. The experience and insights gained by Siemens during this pilot project will be directly incorporated into the development of new components. The project’s aim is to find out how electric cars and the charging infrastructure can be best coordinated with one another. Siemens is also involved in a number of other pilot projects such as Harz.EE-mobility and Drive eCharged.
The latter project is taking place in the Munich model region and is run in cooperation with BMW and the Munich municipal utility company SWM. A total of 40 electric MINI E cars have so far been issued to test drivers, who will use the vehicles in the Munich area for ten months. Siemens is providing the infrastructure for the private and public charging stations, and SWM is supplying the green electricity.
Another focus of the project is to investigate the possibilities of fast charging with direct current, which would allow electric vehicles to be used for long distances of several hundred kilometers.
Yes. Depots of large lead acid batteries can supply cheap quick charging for electric cars. But stationary methane powered engines can do it cheaper and more efficiently. Stationary flywheels also can do it well and more efficiently. But there is no reason to not have a range small, 10kw or far less, range extender built in. It can run on certified organic cellulostic bioethanol, but someone in the world or more will be more hungry or cold because he could have eaten the ethanol. ..HG..
Posted by: Henry Gibson | 12 October 2010 at 01:10 PM
And less hung over.
I am with you on the range extender.
Enough to drive at 60 mph on the level would do it (and some). Might be more than 10KW, but no matter.
It may not have to be that efficient, just small and quiet and easy to top up.
Posted by: mahonj | 12 October 2010 at 04:13 PM
stay off the autobahn with these. Strictly for city driving at 35 or 40 mph. Interesting as many people already take the U-bahn or S-bahn to work.
Posted by: TM | 12 October 2010 at 05:56 PM
In cold climates such as those of northern and eastern Europe, an ICE genset is essential to supply cabin heat, defrosting heat, and battery-warming heat. Renewable fuels for these genset will be essential in order to remain CO2 neutral.
In a smaller PHEV, a 20-kW ICE will be all that'll be needed to provide unlimited driving range and for winter heat, all for much lower cost, if this ICE is in the form of a parallel hybrid. With exhaust heat recuperation for cabin heating and defrosting, thermal efficiency of this PHEV may be over 90%.
Posted by: Roger Pham | 13 October 2010 at 12:41 AM
Aside from your preconceptions, Roger, why does cold-climate operation require a parallel-hybrid drivetrain?
Posted by: Engineer-Poet | 13 October 2010 at 09:23 AM
It does not. However, parallel-hybrid is cheaper and lighter, and is more efficient due to the direct coupling of engine to drive train at cruise, hence may find more market penetration. A battery-centric PHEV will not need a transmission unit, or at most, a two-speed unit for use in cruise only. A parallel-serial hybrid will have a small engine driving a small generator (20kW), and at low speed, it will run in serial mode. At cruise speed, the engine will be coupled directly to the drive train, thereby eliminating electrical loss. The electric motor will provide boost for acceleration when needed at cruise, thereby preventing downshift. Because the engine provides additional torque at cruise speed from 40-80 mph, the motor and the power inverter can be smaller, thereby saving weight and cost and internal space.
Look at the Volt's hwy mpg when on engine power alone (35-40 mpg), vs. the Prius' hwy mpg(48-50 mpg), and you can see that the 75% mechanical torque coupling of the Prius has resulted in much higher hwy mileage. There may be other factors in the Prius' higher mpg, but I think that the direct mechanical coupling is largely responsible for this gain.
Posted by: Roger Pham | 13 October 2010 at 12:33 PM
Not that it matters. The Volt sustainer isn't even using the Atkinson cycle; that can be fixed. The bulk of driving will be done on electricity; the practical difference between 180 MPG and 230 MPG is small enough to leave to a couple model years down the line.
Posted by: Engineer-Poet | 14 October 2010 at 06:19 AM
A serial-parallel HEV or PHEV will combine the torque from both the engine and the motor when maximum power is desired, allowing a smaller motor and power inverter for a given level of performance. There is no need for "full performance in EV mode," since full performance in combined mode is more fitting of a hybrid.
In the "Power mode," the engine will be kept warm and will be restarted once every 5 minutes or so to keep the catalytic converter warm enough, in case a power boost will be needed in the battery-dominant mode.
In the "Economy mode," as selectable by the driver, the engine won't be started until the battery is sufficiently depleted. Economy-conscious drivers will not need the extra boost from the engine, and power-oriented drivers can sacrifice some efficiency.
Agree that fuel consumption of a taxi could be halved by operating the engine at the optimal speed/load point. That's why we have serial-parallel HEV with an electric-only mode at low speeds and low loads, when the ICE would be least efficient. The ICE would only be started when it can deliver optimal efficiency. The ICE is downsized enough so that it can run with optimal efficiency when coupled directly to the drive train at cruise speeds.
http://gas2.org/2010/08/24/chevy-volt-achieves-less-than-30-mpg-after-battery-depleted/
(testimony of a real-world driver)
Posted by: Roger Pham | 14 October 2010 at 07:52 PM
I'm not swayed by the results of a single test driver over 16.1 miles. The sort of driving you do to "put it through some rigorous paces" and conclude it “borders on sporty and is fun” is neither what the average driver does, nor what many of the remainder do every day (and the sort of driver who does would probably not have a Volt); still, the car got "a combined 100 MPG over those 59.7 miles of driving". The Volt's range extender will mostly be used on longer trips, cruising on highways. If the operation is 80/20 electric/gas, even at 27.3 MPG on gas it would average 136.5 MPG; more likely we'd see over 200 MPG. That's good enough for a while.
Posted by: Engineer-Poet | 15 October 2010 at 05:00 AM
Skimping in power electric is false economy?
Let's consider the $41,000 price tag of the Volt, vs. $22,500 for the Prius. The battery in the Volt costs ~$8000. The Prius' battery costs~1000 wholesale, may be ~$2000 retail. Substracting $1000 from the $8000 and adding this $7000 to the MSRP of $22,500 of the HEV Prius will give $28,500 for the cost of a hypothetical PHEV Prius with LG Chem's 16kWh Li-ion battery pack. So, $28,500 vs. $41,000, and this is false economy?
One may think that operating a serial PHEV in heat-led mode in the winter by running the ICE, efficiency does not matter much, since waste heat is utilized. However, even in the heat-led mod whereby waste heat is utilized, the waste heat from electrical losses may be too cool for defrosting or even for cabin heating in the deep freeze of Moscow or Berlin. If the motor and power electronics are to be air cooled, then, this waste heat may not be recoverable for cabin and windshield defrosting. So, minimizing electrical losses and drive train losses will still be the best approach to increase overall efficiency, even in the heat-led mode, so that coolant heat and exhaust heat can be used to the best extent.
Posted by: Roger Pham | 15 October 2010 at 01:27 PM
The Prius has trivial all-electric range and speed, so it's not a valid basis for comparison.
Posted by: Engineer-Poet | 16 October 2010 at 10:09 AM
Would you not get a sweet spot with a ~2-5 kWh battery and ~100kW output, such a system could cover all non highway travel of a vehicle, and still provide enough power reserves for overtaking and accelerating to highway speeds.
I think its a shame the volt didn't go for a smaller atkinson cycle range extender
Posted by: 3PeaceSweet | 17 October 2010 at 10:33 AM
Thanks, Eng-Poet, for your continous interest in this topic, which also interests me tremendously.
The Volt has a 50 kW engine, a 50 kW generator, and a 110 kW motor, with an estimated curb weight of 3520 lbs. Since the 110 kW motor is the motive force, this will be the power rating of the vehicle
To match this 110 kW power rating when designing a serial-parallel hybrid with same payload rating, we can start with a 55 kW motor#1, a 30 kW engine and a 30 kW generator/motor#2. When the engine is clutched to the drive train, the combination of engine and generator/motor#2 will add another 60 kW of power to the 55kW motor, for a combined total power rating of 115 kW. Interestingly, the sum total of installed generator/motor power is only 80 kW, vs. 160 kW for the Volt. The installed engine power is only 30 kW, vs 50 kW for the Volt. This 30 kW should be good for 80-90 mph top speed on engine power alone. However, the combined 115 kW of power should allow ~120 mph top speed until the battery is out of juice.
Now, then, ask yourself, why do we need 16 kWh of battery capacity, when 8 kWh of battery will do just fine, allowing seating capacity of 5 instead of 4 as in the Volt, and shaving ~200 lbs of weight and ~$4000-5000 USD off the retail price?
The reduction in installed motor/generator/power inverters/cooling accessories/engine capacity should shave another 300-400 lbs off the curb weight. The vehicle's tire, wheel, suspension, chassis can also be enlightened as well, shaving off another ~200 lbs of weight. I can see a total saving of ~700 lbs of weight in this lighter serial-parallel PHEV version, and at least $10,000 USD off the retail price.
Because the new vehicle will be much lighter, it will easily do 25-27 miles in all EV mode out of the 8kWh battery pack. If your commute is >20 miles each way, then all the owners of this reduced-range PHEV can use this excuse to ask for a reserved parking spot right next to the building, essentially a VIP spot, while laughing all the way to the bank depositing the ~$10,000 USD that you've just saved. Owners of the Volt, with 40 mi all EV range, will likely be denied the coveted charging lot at work if they live less than 20 miles from their work place!
What about all EV performance of our lighter serial-parallel PHEV? We will provide it with a two-speed transmission from the 55 kW motor to the drive train in order to double the motor's torque from 0 to 50 mph. This will provide it with superior acceleration over that of the Volt, up to 50 mph. Above 50 mph, the engine and the generator/motor#2 will be clutched on to give it another ~50 kW of power in high gear, thus exceeding the acceleration of the Volt, given the fact that we are ~700 lbs lighter.
Ain't bad, eh?
Posted by: Roger Pham | 17 October 2010 at 11:38 PM
Roger, you're really not getting the point.
Which is not even close to the same capability. It can only provide 110 kW to the wheels when all are in flat-out motor mode (max speed), and is limited to 55 kW in all-electric mode.Because that's what it takes to get
- 40 miles of AER while
- limiting the charge/discharge range to achieve the specified warranty figures of 10 years and 150,000 miles.
If you want to cut the battery bulk and cost, the obvious way is to make it a service item. If you could revive the Firefly Energy 3D^2 design, you could probably make a 10 kWh battery half the size of the Volt's pack and get it to last 3-5 years. At 1/4 the price per kWh, it would cost about 16% as much. If you're paying 8% on a car loan, the interest savings would pay for the battery replacements.Posted by: Engineer-Poet | 18 October 2010 at 10:47 AM
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