If they can make this work to where the Aluminum is around the cost of gasoline per mile, it could eliminate the need for a fast charging infrastructure. A BEV that gets 100mi of range, but uses this to extend the range to 300 miles or more would pretty much fill the needs for almost every driver.

So for 90%+ of your days, you'd simply use the li-ion pack in the vehicle, charged at your house/work. For the rare occasion you need to go beyond that range or just neglect to charge, you use the Aluminum-Air.

Think of it as a rechargeable battery that can only be recharged in a factory.

As people say, it would make a great range extender, and could be swapped quickly.

Plus, you could possibly rebuild them at night, using excess energy (wind, or excess day solar).

Gorr, I'm starting to appreciate your sly sense of humor. I hope Harvey does too.

Just think - these could be the first alcohol powered cars. As in drink the beer, flatten the can, and insert into your battery pack. Or drink soda pop if you don't drink alcohol, and call it a sugar powered car.

Actually, I am thrilled at this announcement. I just hope that Phinergy doesn't get crushed by Alcoa.

I'm curious to know which of the staff at ev insider is posting here under that nom de plume.

Of course many here post with something other than their name, but not as the name of a company or a website.

The key issues here are what is the efficiency of this alum/air battery and what is the efficiency of conversion of Al(OH)3 to metal Al and at what cost per kWh for the conversion process?

Is the weight of the Aluminum Hydroxide as waste product counted into the entire gravimetric energy density of the battery? As the Al is oxidized, the O2 will probably be removed from the air and added to the vehicle in the Al(OH)3 tank.

Otherwise, this appears to be a promising idea. The summer solar energy can be converted to Al metal to be used in the winter, so, seasonal energy storage might work if it will be cost-effective.

HarveyD, you're right about aluminum smelting using huge amounts of electricity. Giant electrodes are plunged into the molten bauxite to get what we think of as aluminum. In fact, it takes 95% less energy to melt an aluminum can than to refine an equivalent amount of bauxite into aluminum.

@Roger Pham, I think you've hit the nail on the head. What are the conversion losses of cycling aluminum? It's a bad idea if the losses are much higher than Lithium Air, or Lithium Sulfur or such. It's the same problem with generating H2 for Fuel Cells. The H2 energy has to come from somewhere, and if too much energy is lost putting energy into H2, it's bad storage medium.

The following is some data regarding the round-trip efficiency of Al-Air battery, from Wiki:

"Aluminium as a "fuel" for vehicles has been studied by Yang and Knickle.[1] They concluded the following:

The Al/air battery system can generate enough energy and power for driving ranges and acceleration similar to gasoline powered cars...the cost of aluminium as an anode can be as low as US$ 1.1/kg as long as the reaction product is recycled. The total fuel efficiency during the cycle process in Al/air electric vehicles (EVs) can be 15% (present stage) or 20% (projected), comparable to that of internal combustion engine vehicles (ICEs) (13%). The design battery energy density is 1300 Wh/kg (present) or 2000 Wh/kg (projected). The cost of battery system chosen to evaluate is US$ 30/kW (present) or US$ 29/kW (projected). Al/air EVs life-cycle analysis was conducted and compared to lead/acid and nickel metal hydride (NiMH) EVs. Only the Al/air EVs can be projected to have a travel range comparable to ICEs. From this analysis, Al/air EVs are the most promising candidates compared to ICEs in terms of travel range, purchase price, fuel cost, and life-cycle cost."

Apparently, 15% round-trip efficiency needs a lot of work for Al-Air battery. A solid fuel may also impose additional difficulty for refueling.

>>>>>"The above very early efficiency estimates will probably be overpassed by 100% by 2020 or so."

On what basis do you make this prediction, Harvey? The researchers quoted above predicted only 33% improvement in round-trip efficiency of Al-air battery, not 100% improvement.

Not so easy to change out the Aluminum anode of the Al-air battery, Harvey, since a battery is made up of many cells serially connected together. The anode of each cell must be replaced individually, meaning the entire battery pack must be opened and the anode plates must be removed and replaced with new plates. Essentially, the battery pack must be rebuilt, at additional labor cost. It may be faster to swap out the whole battery, similar to the Better Place scheme, but then this will open up a whole list of new problems, since the battery pack will weigh hundreds of pounds and will be made in many different forms and configuration to suit different car models and application.

With H2, you simply put in the filling nozzle and be done in a few minutes. H2 can flow in pipelines to move from place to place, and pipeline transportation is the cheapest and most efficient to transport fuels from place to place.

The well to wheel efficiency of these cells is not really important if they are being used as a range extender periodically.

If they were used like a spare tire - only when really needed - it would give a great deal of peace of mind to many BEV drivers at very little cost. For example, using Yang and Knickle's current figures, a 13kWh battery would weigh only 10kg, 22lbs and cost only $390. That's pretty cheap insurance for 40 miles or so of on-tap emergency range with very little weight penalty.

A comparable Li ion battery would be ~$3,900 and weigh about 150 kg, 330 lbs.

I can even imagine a 1/4 size application - 10 miles range, 5.5 lbs, $100. It would likely be a popular option. Even if manufacturers didn't build it in, I can imagine a robust 3rd party market (spare gas can, without the risk).

When used, the battery would cost $9.75 per mile, but if it wasn't used, the unit would likely retain much of its value, just like a spare wheel and tire.

I was just using the figures from the Yang and Knickle study. I would hope that the cost could be much lower based on recycled aluminum cost, but I don't have any data for this. My point was just that even if this was ridiculously un-economic for a typical fuel use, it could still be a useful component of any EV as a "spare" given its tremendous energy density and unlimited shelf life.