This is a major step in power density from FCs. Toyota and others will have to do more to catch up.

The next generation will possibly hit 5 KW/Kg and per Liter.

To bad H2 is not produced on board with an ultra light high efficiency converter?

Its amazing how many battery only advocates powered by solar either live in the tropics or don't fancy driving their cars in winter.

For anyone much north of San Diego the real equation is solar converted to something which can store it in vast quantities the regenerate electricity, or using hydrogen which already has the storage built in.

So the supposed efficiency comparisons are utterly meaningless.

EP's advocacy of nuclear to power battery cars is a very different matter, as that makes sense winter and summer.

I'd like that too, but they aren't building the nuclear plants to power it in the West.

eci:

Here you go:
'The new catalyst has a solar-to-hydrogen conversion efficiency of 2%. The best water-splitting photocatalyst to date is nanocrystalline cobalt oxide, which has a conversion efficiency of around 5%.2 However, this began to lose its activity within 1 hour. The current photocatalyst, however, showed no degradation after 200 days. The researchers calculate that if they optimised their photocatalyst so it had a 5% conversion rate this would lower the cost of hydrogen production to $2.30/kg (£1.50/kg) – well below the US Department of Energy’s target of $4/kg. ‘Even at this stage, the number we get is only about $6,’ says co-author Yeshayahu Lifshitz, now at Technion – Israel Institute of Technology.'

http://fuelcellsworks.com/news/2015/03/03/sun-rises-on-new-solar-route-to-hydrogen/

You must have been following entirely different technological publications to me if you reckon that batteries are progressing faster than either fuel cells or hydrogen production technologies.

@ Davemart,

Leave solar out of the well-to-wheels equation and most FC are still suspect. Cogeneration natural gas plants can convert at up to 80% efficiency. Put that into, and out of a battery and it's still likely better than the 60% claimed for an FC. There are conversion losses for refining fuels for FC which that 60% number probably doesn't include.

DM:
Not a battery only advocate here; I like the idea of nuclear helping to fill the gap until all his shakes out. The less coal and Natural Gas we burn for power the better. I don't support H2 presently because it encourages the continuing mining and nasty conversion of hydrocarbons to high pressure hydrogen, completely controlled by the oil companies. A move from a hundred years of "Gasoline 1" to "Gasoline 2" if you will.

Seeking Alpha does not seem to be working properly at the moment, but I have analysed the comparative figures for FCEVs and BEVs there, from mostly DOE data, and there is basically nothing in it for emissions between fuel cell cars and battery ones, after all losses are accounted for.

That is using present systems.

For future systems whilst assuming no progress at all in hydrogen generation technology the assumption is that solar will rise from the present 1% of generation to a very large proportion, whilst the issues that most BEV charging takes place at night and much worse in many places there is not a lot of sunshine in winter is simply magicked away.

HealthyBreeze:
For your system all that would need doing is for most of the generating capacity in the US to be replaced, and of course most of the houses and industry would need relocating, as they are not put in place where the heated water from combined heat and power can be used.
Holland where it is common has rather higher density housing.

If people are determined not to use fuel cells in cars, then the best way would be to use fuel cells in the home, where the waste heat could actually be used.

That does indeed approach 80% or better efficiency.

Of course if you have the same fuel cell in the car, that same waste heat obviates much of the loss of range in winter of battery cars.

Most of the problems of both battery cars and fuel cell ones disappear if one combines them in intelligent ways instead of setting up false dichotomies.

It simply is not much fun on a long run hanging around for half an hour plus recharging batteries, however many problems Tesla advocates seem to think the whole population suffers with their bladder.

Conversely a decent sized pack in FCEVs would mean that many less hydrogen stations were needed, and where convenient solar daytime workplace charging which really is more efficient could be used.

That is a very different matter to pretending that you are using solar when you plug your car in at night or in the winter.

Catering for that is going to involve losses one way or another in any case, unless there is a massive build out of nuclear.

I continue to be fascinated by the either/or debates in these threads. As technology develops markets will change, but I suspect there will be a place for both BEV and FCEV. The real game changer for fuel cells will be in-home use, where it can heat the house and generate electricity to charge the PHEV in winter. Distributed energy and new storage schemes will change our world, we just don't yet know how.

@JMartin:
A PHEV with smaller battery pack (10-20 kWh) and a small (15-25 KW) FC range extender could be ideal in cold places?

I am excited to own either an EV or a Plugin hybrid fuel cell.

I am curious whether the hype from the EV fans is correct, or if the industry is correct. Looking at the funding that is going into each, I believe that the less mature fuel cell is becoming at a rapid pace a realty.

Apart from the volt, bolt, and the model s there isn't a whole lot of direct replacements for the ice. I think fuel cells can get us there quicker, and in the long term we may return to a BEV solution.

And as Harvey points out... If the battery pack is a decent size, you can make due with a smaller cell. But again that could cause some issue, it would have to be sized correctly to generate enough power to go up an incline at a speed higher than 75mph. Which could be very well around 25kw of power.

We don't have to have massive fuel cells to get huge boosts or range from an EV.

Again I see EVs dominating any thing B class and smaller. D class and larger, or in platforms that tow/haul or do a lot of stationary generation will probably fuel cells domain. C class well probably see some overlap, or interesting combinations for the two.

As several point out, waste heat is welcome in colder climates. Especially in mobility. When current cars generate 70%+ heat, and still sometimes do an inadequate job at heating the cabin and glazing, it could stand to reason that 20-40% wasted by FCs could be useful. I am very curious to know how heating the cabin is done on the fuel cell vehicles today, if they are in fact tapping into it. Next time I am on all data ill take a look.

I hope Tesla and other giga factories can bring sub $100/kwh packs into reality... It would make a very interesting future, a very exciting one no less.

We might see laptop and phone batteries at a reasonable price too!